Do Advanced ET Species Know We're Here??? - Tilted Forum Project - TFP - Sexuality, Philosophy and Political Discussion

DaveOrion · 09-10-2007, 01:38 PM

I thought I'd split the thread 'The Golden Record' before Crompsin has a cow. I'm not sayin he's a thread nazi or anything, I just dont want to see a fellow airborne brother completely stroke out.

I've taken the liberty of compiling the offending material into a barely cohesive blob of something.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaveMatrix

If they are out there, they already know how screwy we are. Our TV & radio signals have been beamed out into space, at the speed of light, for over 60 years (see 'Contact',w/Jodi Foster, Great Intro). These signals are traveling much faster than voyager.......God only knows how some ET will interpret that eclectic mix of humanities thoughts & ideas.......I hope the ET's are friendly, or we're royally screwed.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crompsin

Listening is one thing, but holding a shiny flat round thing in your hand is another.

So is holding a slinky with your alien tentacle paws. Or an AK47 assault rifle.

...

'Sides, any intelligent life out there will eventually intercept rerun episodes of Friends and automatically determine that our entire planet is completely barren of intelligence.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaveMatrix

I can see the insight one might gain from personal contact with an ET object, but voyager is simply traveling to slow, it hasnt even reached the next system, Alpha Centauri. TV & radio signals seem more likely to really reach out, over 60 light years in all directions so far. Thats already past the 100 closest stars in this galaxy.

Quote:

Originally Posted by albania

There's a definite limit to how well one can resolve a signal from background noise. My gut tells me that to get anything useful an alien species would have to be pretty damn close to Earth. That is not to say they wouldn't be able to detect signals that came from Earth, thus proving that we're an "intelligent" species, they just would never be able to make anything coherent out of them much less see a rerun of friends or what have you.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaveMatrix

I'd never say never, a highly advanced ET species may have technology that is capable of eliminating the background noise and the cleaning up the signals. We're pretty good at that right here on good ole mother earth.

Quote:

Originally Posted by albania

I didn’t thing I said never. But there are a few issues at hand here, first is that the universe is full of stuff, including background radiation that is everywhere even in sectors of "empty space". As photons travel through space they interact with what’s around them. They deviate in course they lose energy and they get absorbed. Second, even assuming there was a sector of empty space and direct path from your light beam to whomever you were transmitting to you'd still never be able to get the full message across at any distance. This is so because it is impossible to create photons that will travel perfectly parallel to each other and there are practical size constraints to making a receiver. As the distance to your intended target increases you'll need a bigger and bigger receiver to pick up the complete message. If you could travel all the way out to infinity you'd need an infinitely large receiver. All these things make my intuitive physicist side tingle; my gut feeling is that no one will be seeing crappy reruns of any show here on earth sixty light years away.

At distances of the earth and solar system even it's not as bad, but we have help we know the approximate location of the receivers and transmitters and of the stuff in between them, and all sorts of clever tricks make it possible for us to share information effectively.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaveMatrix

Actually you did say "never".

Quote:
Originally Posted by albania
they just would "never" be able to make anything coherent out of them much less see a rerun of friends or what have you.

A quick look at wikepedia turned up this little fact,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SETI

Quote:
From 1995 through March 2004, Phoenix conducted observing campaigns at the 64-meter Parkes radio telescope in Australia, the 140 Foot Telescope of the National Radio Astronomy Observatory in West Virginia, USA, and the Arecibo Observatory in Puerto Rico. The project observed the equivalent of 800 stars over the available channels in the frequency range from 1200 to 3000 MHz. The search was sensitive enough to pick up transmitters with power output equivalent to airport radars to a distance of about 200 light years.

If we have the ability to pick up a signal equivalent to an airport radar, from 200 light years away, then an advanced ET species could surely do the same.

Quote:

Originally Posted by albania

Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveMatrix
Actually you did say "never".

I should learn to read, yes you should have a problem when someone says never.

I talked to my Electricity and Magnetism professor. He said it was plausible to send a communication of some sort to places even a 100 light years away, we have dishes large enough on earth that could also pick up such a message assuming the power was sufficient. He said that since tv signals are not generally pointed into sectors of space that it wouldn't be likely for aliens to ever see any tv show.

While I do respect college professors, some may have closed minds when it comes to "new" ideas. I dont think its out of the realm of possibility, and it may be exceedingly difficult, just not impossible. Since he said it wouldn't be likely, that must also mean that theres a chance it is likely.

Ourcrazymodern? · 09-10-2007, 01:57 PM

Is this another parallel universe? It seems to me beyond doubt that others exist. It seems quite likely that we're all in the same boat. -I'd really like to read some alien science fiction.

I love you, DaveMatrix!

DaveOrion · 09-10-2007, 02:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ourcrazymodern?

Is this another parallel universe? It seems to me beyond doubt that others exist. It seems quite likely that we're all in the same boat. -I'd really like to read some alien science fiction.

I love you, DaveMatrix!

Indeed it is! (another parallel universe, only in reverse) Just another pretext to talk about silly ass possibilities that could never be......or could they???

I'm quite fond of you OCM, but dont say love, BOR will get jealous!!

I thought I'd throw this in, just because it has nothing to do with this thread, Ok, only slightly. I simply find Jodie Foster in this role incredibly hot..... intelligent, driven, sexy.....

Setting - The VeryLargeArray in New Mexico - BASE OF TELESCOPE - PRE-DAWN

Ellie wears a pair of headsets. We hear the SOUND of the COSMOS, the background wash of empty STATIC...

...and a faint BEEPING, FADING IN and OUT of reception.

Ellie slowly swims up to consciousness. After a moment her eyes open. She sits up --

Crompsin · 09-10-2007, 03:45 PM

MOOOOO!

It's a boy!

DaveOrion · 09-10-2007, 03:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crompsin

MOOOOO!

It's a boy!

Well Said!!

SecretMethod70 · 09-11-2007, 01:56 AM

There is, in my mind, without a doubt, intelligent life elsewhere in the universe. The odds that the intelligent life developed even remotely close to Earth and survived long enough to come up with the technology necessary to communicate with us, on the other hand, are ridiculously small. I forget the math, but I'm pretty sure that it's very unlikely that any other intelligent life exists within our specific galaxy, and communicating to other galaxies is a fantastic feat indeed.

In short, "they're" out there, but neither of us (humans or aliens) are likely to survive long enough to find out about it. It's truly a shame if you ask me.

DaveOrion · 09-11-2007, 02:42 AM

Its also possible that life is very common in the universe, yet we are simply unable to detect it. This is known as the Fermi Paradox....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SETI

Quote:

The size and age of the universe incline us to believe that many technologically advanced civilizations must exist. However, this belief seems logically inconsistent with our lack of observational evidence to support it. Either the initial assumption is incorrect and technologically advanced intelligent life is much rarer than we believe, our current observations are incomplete and we simply have not detected them yet, or our search methodologies are flawed and we are not searching for the correct indicators.

The more data thats gathered the more we will eventually know. It may seem that life here on earth is a stroke of luck, that all the right conditions just happened to fall in place, and that this is exceedingly rare. The rare earth hypothesis does have some hard facts to back it up.....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Principle_of_mediocrity

Quote:

Earth is the right orbital distance from a non-binary, metal-rich star (the Sun) with stable radiation over an ideal frequency spectrum. If the Sun were larger, it would burn too quickly for life to evolve and if it were smaller, the Earth would need to be closer, making it tidally locked.
Earth has a nearly circular orbit. This condition is not rare in our solar system, possibly due to Jupiter's gravitational influence, but observations of exosolar planets suggest that it is rare in general.
Earth is a silicate rock with the prerequisite mass, plate tectonics, and iron core to protect developing life from radiation.
Jupiter and the other large outer planets shield the Earth from asteroids without destabilizing its orbit as well as shuttling water-rich comets from the outer solar system to the inner.
Earth has the perfect amount of water for a long-term active hydrosphere.
The Moon is anomalously massive, creating large oceanic tides, and stabilizing the Earth's axial tilt. According to Jacques Laskar's calculations this critical feature is otherwise impossible to achieve.
The manner in which the Moon was created, by collision of a mars-sized body with Earth, may have stripped the Earth of some of its crust material. This deficit of crust material allows plate tectonics. Without plate tectonics the Earth might undergo essentially complete volcanic resurfacing as Venus does.
The Earth's location within the galaxy is rare and important: "Not in the center of the galaxy, not in a globular cluster, not near an active gamma ray source, not in a multiple-star system, or near a pulsar, or near stars too small, too large, or soon to go supernova."
Earth's orbital and temperature stability over billions of years is exceedingly rare, as is its insulation from cataclysmic events.

This is in direct contradiction with SETI's guiding principle of mediocrity, which basically states that there is nothing special about humans or the earth.

I prefer to remain open minded and keep a 'wait and see' attitude. I certainly hope we're not all alone.

Midnight · 09-11-2007, 02:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaveMatrix

I'm quite fond of you OCM, but dont say love, Midnight will get jealous!!

I beg your pardon? jealous of what? Um OCM, you can say whatever you like!

SecretMethod70 · 09-11-2007, 03:11 AM

I think maybe you misunderstand what I mean DaveMatrix. I don't think Earth is special at all, speaking literally in the universal sense. If every galaxy in the universe were to have one planet with intelligent life, that would be ~100 billion+ species of intelligent life! It would also still be spaced out enough that none of them would ever likely discover the other.

DaveOrion · 09-11-2007, 03:52 AM

I probably did misunderstand, I just woke up and quickly put together that incomprehensible pile of words.

Midnight I was only joking, as was OCM, but I will edit my post so I wont offend your delicate sensibilities. Jeeeeeezzzz.......

ASU2003 · 09-11-2007, 04:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaveMatrix

I thought I'd throw this in, just because it has nothing to do with this thread, Ok, only slightly. I simply find Jodie Foster in this role incredibly hot..... intelligent, driven, sexy.....

Setting - The VeryLargeArray in New Mexico - BASE OF TELESCOPE - PRE-DAWN

Ellie wears a pair of headsets. We hear the SOUND of the COSMOS, the background wash of empty STATIC...

...and a faint BEEPING, FADING IN and OUT of reception.

Ellie slowly swims up to consciousness. After a moment her eyes open. She sits up --

That is one of my favorite movies. And she is so attractive in it. A lot of it has to do with her playing a nerdy space girl.

As to the original question, I doubt that an ET species would know that we are here. We haven't been here long enough. And if they were close enough to detect us, then we would have detected them probably.

But I do think that there is life elsewhere in the universe. Maybe even elsewhere outside of our solar system but close by in the Milky Way galaxy. But it probably isn't extremely advanced.

SecretMethod70 · 09-11-2007, 04:24 AM

Yeah, speaking in terms of life, period, as opposed to intelligent life, I wouldn't be surprised if life were quite abundant. I'd speculate that life has occurred on at least a couple bodies within our very own solar system at some time (but may not necessarily exist at this very moment). The trick is having the right conditions for life to develop beyond a few cells (assuming the biology is even similar to ours). And then, after the life develops to any sort of substantial size (think animal as opposed to bacteria), it has to then develop under the right conditions to become intelligent.

So life? All over. Intelligent life? Common on the cosmic scale, extremely uncommon on the human scale.

DaveOrion · 09-11-2007, 06:14 AM

This brings up the idea that life may have been seeded into the solar system by comets or asteroids carrying dormant bacteria, instead of spontaneously appearing from ancient pools of slime. This does seem more likely and would also mean that other parts of the galaxy may have been seeded in the same way. However each planet where life might have been seeded would evolve its own particular traits best suited for that environment.

I doubt it would be anything even close to star trek, where most species have human form with a funny looking head. We may not even know what to look for, since other life forms may not even be carbon based. I'm sure that the truth is much stranger than any fiction.

Ourcrazymodern? · 09-11-2007, 08:31 AM

Maybe we're the offspring of extra-terrestrial garbage...at least there's enough love to go around.

...Cool thread you've created, sir!

Racnad · 09-11-2007, 08:44 AM

At this point, all opinions how common or rare extraterristrial life is, intelligent ET life, and technologically advanced ET life is, and howrare or common earth-like planets are, are all speculation.

Another thing to consider is that all man-made radio transmisions are less than 100 years old. This means that unless technologocally advanced ETs are with 100 light years, or have some sort of listening post that converts electromagnetic transmissions to sub-space communicaitons or whatever (to borrow pure sci-fi term from Star Trek), the ETs don't know about us.

Ustwo · 09-11-2007, 09:39 AM

Any alien life will most likely be carbon based because carbon based life has the best 'chemistry' going for it.

Odds are that if we were to find an alien 'earth' the amazing thing wouldn't be the differences but the similarities.

For example, despite the last common ancestor the marsupial and placental mammals being nothing much more than a shrew, both types had/have evolved into all types of animals which fill the same niche and due to natural selection fill the niche with the same form. The Tasmanian wolf wasn't a canine but it looked like one because that 'form' fits the role for example. In fact the only major form that didn't show up among marsupials was the gazelle type, which instead has had the role filled by kangaroos. Though even there, we have rodents in Africa that while not related to kangaroos for 10's of millions of years, and whos last common ancestor didn't look like a kangaroo at all, developed the same form.

So while an alien planet may well have really cool unique forms of life, odds are it will also have a flying squirrel form, a dog form, a cat form, a horse form, a tree form, a moss form, a fish form etc, which while completely different in chemistry or evolutionary path, is doing, acting, and living the same way as their earth equivalent.

Racnad · 09-11-2007, 11:30 AM

Another example are whales and dolphins which strongly resemble fish but are not related to fish at all. That suggests that any other planets with higher forms of life (even if it has a radically different chemistry and is based on a liquid other than water) are going to have fish or animals that look like fish.

DaveOrion · 09-11-2007, 11:24 PM

I suppose this an example of convergent evolution, where animals that are not closely related develop similar characteristics, while adapting to similar environments. Another convergent pair of species would be the dolphin and the ichthyosaurs, one being a mammal and the other reptilian, yet both developed an almost identical body style, 100 million years apart.

Since we have only planet to base our theories on, all this is only speculation as Racnad said. Other planets may evolve similar evolutionary convergence, or go in some direction that know one ever dreamed of. They could not all be stranger than we imagine, they could be stranger than we can imagine.

The_Jazz · 09-12-2007, 07:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ustwo

Any alien life will most likely be carbon based because carbon based life has the best 'chemistry' going for it.

Odds are that if we were to find an alien 'earth' the amazing thing wouldn't be the differences but the similarities.

For example, despite the last common ancestor the marsupial and placental mammals being nothing much more than a shrew, both types had/have evolved into all types of animals which fill the same niche and due to natural selection fill the niche with the same form. The Tasmanian wolf wasn't a canine but it looked like one because that 'form' fits the role for example. In fact the only major form that didn't show up among marsupials was the gazelle type, which instead has had the role filled by kangaroos. Though even there, we have rodents in Africa that while not related to kangaroos for 10's of millions of years, and whos last common ancestor didn't look like a kangaroo at all, developed the same form.

So while an alien planet may well have really cool unique forms of life, odds are it will also have a flying squirrel form, a dog form, a cat form, a horse form, a tree form, a moss form, a fish form etc, which while completely different in chemistry or evolutionary path, is doing, acting, and living the same way as their earth equivalent.

That makes the assumption that the conditions would be similar to Earth, which I don't necessarily buy, at least as far as physical forms go. If you compare land-based and water-based life forms here, the functions that they perform are shockingly similar but the forms are dictated by the conditions - which is why sharks and dolphins have such similar body shapes. The simpler the life form, the more likely that there will be something similar-looking here. There will be an algea-form and a moss form, most likely tree- and grass-forms as well as fish-forms (making some assumptions) that look similar to what Earth has come up with. I doubt that anyone would ever be able to find something completely analogous for every niche between two planets.

Behaviors are a different issue, and we've seen that repeated over and over in the fossil record. Large plant-eaters emerge along with forms to hunt them, scavenge off the remains and on down.

Ustwo · 09-12-2007, 12:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The_Jazz

That makes the assumption that the conditions would be similar to Earth, which I don't necessarily buy, at least as far as physical forms go.

While we can speculate about different chemistries supporting life, we can't really narrow down in the least how it could work practically. While I don't think all life must be in the Goldilocks zone, I think that there is an upper and lower limit to how much energy must be present.

Odds are we will be long dead (hell perhaps extinct) before these questions can be answered.

DaveOrion · 09-13-2007, 03:13 AM

Well, this sure became boring.....this may help.....

How'd that last one get in there??? Strange.......

Ustwo · 09-13-2007, 09:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaveMatrix

How'd that last one get in there??? Strange.......

Is it just me or did the last one have a date with the airbrush?

DaveOrion · 09-13-2007, 11:00 AM

Yes, I'd say that ones airbrushed, but it does give her a nice look. Reminds me of a 'glamor shot', not that she needs it.........

09-10-2007, 01:57 PM	#2 (permalink)
Ourcrazymodern? still, wondering. Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: In beautiful Como Park, St. Paul, MN	Is this another parallel universe? It seems to me beyond doubt that others exist. It seems quite likely that we're all in the same boat. -I'd really like to read some alien science fiction. I love you, DaveMatrix! __________________ BE JUST AND FEAR NOT

09-10-2007, 03:45 PM	#4 (permalink)
Crompsin STRIKE FACE Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Prime Self	MOOOOO! It's a boy! __________________ C19H28O2 = C6H2(NO2)3CH3 All your base are belong to us.

09-11-2007, 01:56 AM	#6 (permalink)
SecretMethod70 Learning Administrator Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Chicago	There is, in my mind, without a doubt, intelligent life elsewhere in the universe. The odds that the intelligent life developed even remotely close to Earth and survived long enough to come up with the technology necessary to communicate with us, on the other hand, are ridiculously small. I forget the math, but I'm pretty sure that it's very unlikely that any other intelligent life exists within our specific galaxy, and communicating to other galaxies is a fantastic feat indeed. In short, "they're" out there, but neither of us (humans or aliens) are likely to survive long enough to find out about it. It's truly a shame if you ask me. __________________ Watch as the internet implodes!: http://www.tfproject.org/tfp/found-n...-implodes.html

09-11-2007, 03:11 AM	#9 (permalink)
SecretMethod70 Learning Administrator Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Chicago	I think maybe you misunderstand what I mean DaveMatrix. I don't think Earth is special at all, speaking literally in the universal sense. If every galaxy in the universe were to have one planet with intelligent life, that would be ~100 billion+ species of intelligent life! It would also still be spaced out enough that none of them would ever likely discover the other. __________________ Watch as the internet implodes!: http://www.tfproject.org/tfp/found-n...-implodes.html

09-11-2007, 03:52 AM	#10 (permalink)
DaveOrion Junkie Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Somewhere Out There	I probably did misunderstand, I just woke up and quickly put together that incomprehensible pile of words. Midnight I was only joking, as was OCM, but I will edit my post so I wont offend your delicate sensibilities. Jeeeeeezzzz....... __________________ The world cares very little about what you know; it is what you are able to do that really matters.

09-11-2007, 04:24 AM	#12 (permalink)
SecretMethod70 Learning Administrator Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Chicago	Yeah, speaking in terms of life, period, as opposed to intelligent life, I wouldn't be surprised if life were quite abundant. I'd speculate that life has occurred on at least a couple bodies within our very own solar system at some time (but may not necessarily exist at this very moment). The trick is having the right conditions for life to develop beyond a few cells (assuming the biology is even similar to ours). And then, after the life develops to any sort of substantial size (think animal as opposed to bacteria), it has to then develop under the right conditions to become intelligent. So life? All over. Intelligent life? Common on the cosmic scale, extremely uncommon on the human scale. __________________ Watch as the internet implodes!: http://www.tfproject.org/tfp/found-n...-implodes.html

09-11-2007, 06:14 AM	#13 (permalink)
DaveOrion Junkie Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Somewhere Out There	This brings up the idea that life may have been seeded into the solar system by comets or asteroids carrying dormant bacteria, instead of spontaneously appearing from ancient pools of slime. This does seem more likely and would also mean that other parts of the galaxy may have been seeded in the same way. However each planet where life might have been seeded would evolve its own particular traits best suited for that environment. I doubt it would be anything even close to star trek, where most species have human form with a funny looking head. We may not even know what to look for, since other life forms may not even be carbon based. I'm sure that the truth is much stranger than any fiction. __________________ The world cares very little about what you know; it is what you are able to do that really matters.

09-11-2007, 08:31 AM	#14 (permalink)
Ourcrazymodern? still, wondering. Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: In beautiful Como Park, St. Paul, MN	Maybe we're the offspring of extra-terrestrial garbage...at least there's enough love to go around. ...Cool thread you've created, sir! __________________ BE JUST AND FEAR NOT

09-11-2007, 08:44 AM	#15 (permalink)
Racnad Crazy Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Washington State	At this point, all opinions how common or rare extraterristrial life is, intelligent ET life, and technologically advanced ET life is, and howrare or common earth-like planets are, are all speculation. Another thing to consider is that all man-made radio transmisions are less than 100 years old. This means that unless technologocally advanced ETs are with 100 light years, or have some sort of listening post that converts electromagnetic transmissions to sub-space communicaitons or whatever (to borrow pure sci-fi term from Star Trek), the ETs don't know about us.

09-11-2007, 09:39 AM	#16 (permalink)
Ustwo Pissing in the cornflakes Join Date: Apr 2003	Any alien life will most likely be carbon based because carbon based life has the best 'chemistry' going for it. Odds are that if we were to find an alien 'earth' the amazing thing wouldn't be the differences but the similarities. For example, despite the last common ancestor the marsupial and placental mammals being nothing much more than a shrew, both types had/have evolved into all types of animals which fill the same niche and due to natural selection fill the niche with the same form. The Tasmanian wolf wasn't a canine but it looked like one because that 'form' fits the role for example. In fact the only major form that didn't show up among marsupials was the gazelle type, which instead has had the role filled by kangaroos. Though even there, we have rodents in Africa that while not related to kangaroos for 10's of millions of years, and whos last common ancestor didn't look like a kangaroo at all, developed the same form. So while an alien planet may well have really cool unique forms of life, odds are it will also have a flying squirrel form, a dog form, a cat form, a horse form, a tree form, a moss form, a fish form etc, which while completely different in chemistry or evolutionary path, is doing, acting, and living the same way as their earth equivalent. __________________ Agents of the enemies who hold office in our own government, who attempt to eliminate our "freedoms" and our "right to know" are posting among us, I fear.....on this very forum. - host Obama - Know a Man by the friends he keeps.

09-11-2007, 11:30 AM	#17 (permalink)
Racnad Crazy Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Washington State	Another example are whales and dolphins which strongly resemble fish but are not related to fish at all. That suggests that any other planets with higher forms of life (even if it has a radically different chemistry and is based on a liquid other than water) are going to have fish or animals that look like fish.

09-11-2007, 11:24 PM	#18 (permalink)
DaveOrion Junkie Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Somewhere Out There	I suppose this an example of convergent evolution, where animals that are not closely related develop similar characteristics, while adapting to similar environments. Another convergent pair of species would be the dolphin and the ichthyosaurs, one being a mammal and the other reptilian, yet both developed an almost identical body style, 100 million years apart. Since we have only planet to base our theories on, all this is only speculation as Racnad said. Other planets may evolve similar evolutionary convergence, or go in some direction that know one ever dreamed of. They could not all be stranger than we imagine, they could be stranger than we can imagine. __________________ The world cares very little about what you know; it is what you are able to do that really matters.

09-13-2007, 03:13 AM	#21 (permalink)
DaveOrion Junkie Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Somewhere Out There	Well, this sure became boring.....this may help..... How'd that last one get in there??? Strange....... __________________ The world cares very little about what you know; it is what you are able to do that really matters.

09-13-2007, 11:00 AM	#23 (permalink)
DaveOrion Junkie Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Somewhere Out There	Yes, I'd say that ones airbrushed, but it does give her a nice look. Reminds me of a 'glamor shot', not that she needs it......... __________________ The world cares very little about what yo