Gh0s7

I recently was reading a book and came across their answer to this question. It was simply put as the study of everything that counts. I basically remember it as another book put it. There are basically five different areas of philosophy with a few others intertwined.
1 - Logic: Whats valid or invalid
2 - Ethics: Whats wrong or right
3 - Epistemology: What do we really know, if anything
4 - Metaphysics: The roll of humans in the universe
5 - Aesthetics: What is beauty, judgement, etc
The others that are intertwined within all of these kinda in the middle would be as follows:
Ontology: The Study of being
Eschatology: End of line matters like death
Teleology: The study of an overall purpose
Idealism and Materialism are involved in all of this as well. I basically brought this up because I have wanted to talk and discuss all of this with someone or many people for the matter but its hard to talk to anyone about this, except hopefully here. This is all up for debate of course. Thanks!

Willravel

Simply put, philosophy is assigning meaning or purpose to things.

Still, I really like the simplicity of the explanations above.

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Crompsin

I think philosophy is man's noble, vain quest to separate himself from the other creatures on Earth.

Philosophy is the system that creates the ideas that we use to give purpose and meaning to the lie that our lives are special outside of eating, sleeping, and procreation. Art, math, science, chocolate pudding, the atom bomb... grand things... they fit in that somewhere.

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C19H28O2 = C6H2(NO2)3CH3

All your base are belong to us.

Willravel

Hey, damn it, I was going to go off on how philosophy is masturbation but you beat me to it. (get it? beat? sorry...)

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Crompsin

I can't do it when you watch.

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C19H28O2 = C6H2(NO2)3CH3

All your base are belong to us.

Baraka_Guru

I think this is more of a side effect.

EDIT:
Why do we do things like make art?



(And why do cats, for that matter?)

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"The great enemy of clear language is insincerity. [...] In our age there is no such thing as 'keeping out of politics.' All issues are political issues, and politics itself is a mass of lies, evasions, folly, hatred, and schizophrenia. When the general atmosphere is bad, language must suffer."

—"Politics and the English Language," George Orwell

"Humankind cannot bear very much reality."

—"Burnt Norton," Four Quartets, T. S. Eliot

Crompsin

We created that world. We allowed that world. Hell, we like that world. Millions of years of evolution and we still cater to the least common denominator. So often we are proud, foolish animals trying to assemble some sort of higher meaning out of the chemical reactions that created us and govern every aspect of our short lives.

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C19H28O2 = C6H2(NO2)3CH3

All your base are belong to us.

Baraka_Guru

No we didn't. We observe it as it unfolds before us. Never ending. Ever changing.

No we didn't. We simply adapted and continue to adapt to the chaos.

No we don't. One cannot like something that cannot be seen and is always changing.

This is what makes us different from any other being in the known universe.

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"The great enemy of clear language is insincerity. [...] In our age there is no such thing as 'keeping out of politics.' All issues are political issues, and politics itself is a mass of lies, evasions, folly, hatred, and schizophrenia. When the general atmosphere is bad, language must suffer."

—"Politics and the English Language," George Orwell

"Humankind cannot bear very much reality."

—"Burnt Norton," Four Quartets, T. S. Eliot

albania

If you're looking at it from a purely descriptive standpoint what you have up there is more than adequate.

Though, my personal take on philosophy is as follows. Philosophy is on a good day 95% bullshit 5% genius, on an average day 98% bullshit and 2% genius and on an off day 100% bullshit. I say this while being an avid reader of philosophy books and having more than an enthusiastic appetite for the field as a hobby.

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My fairest child, I have no song to give you; No lark could pipe to skies so dull and grey: Yet, ere we part, one lesson I can leave you For every day.
Be good, sweet maid, and let who will be clever; Do noble things, not dream them, all day long: And so make life, death, and that vast for-ever One grand, sweet song. -Charles Kingsley

Crompsin

As a species over time? I disagree. I feel we, as a whole race, created our version of the "best of all possible worlds" in each population at any given time in known history. This is not to say the individual experience was awesome (slavery, Holocaust, Friends reruns), but our "hot animal machine" goals have always been the same it seems.

I think our primary instincts are no different than that of a flesh-eating bacteria. Take away our toys and how philosophical are we? About as philosophical as a carrion-eater circling above the African savanna during a drought.

Consume, procreate, consume, procreate. We assign meaning to the consumption to make it a more viable option due to all our free time thanks to "modern" luxury.

__________________
C19H28O2 = C6H2(NO2)3CH3

All your base are belong to us.

Baraka_Guru

If it weren't for a philosophical mind, we would have never invented the wheel. We aren't the same as other animals. "Modern" luxury? Philosophy is thousands of years in the making.

Yes we are slaves to our biology, but that biology includes a mind far more complex than any other animal. We see the world in a completely different way. We think in ways that are impossible for other creatures.

Save the "eating, shitting, and fucking" for the existentialist thread. If you want to discuss it here, then at least pull out some Sartre quotations. They're actually quite fun.

__________________
"The great enemy of clear language is insincerity. [...] In our age there is no such thing as 'keeping out of politics.' All issues are political issues, and politics itself is a mass of lies, evasions, folly, hatred, and schizophrenia. When the general atmosphere is bad, language must suffer."

—"Politics and the English Language," George Orwell

"Humankind cannot bear very much reality."

—"Burnt Norton," Four Quartets, T. S. Eliot

Willravel

You're confusing problem solving and innovation with philosophy. Philosophy has nothing to do with the invention of the wheel.

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Baraka_Guru

I should clarify. I don't mean to say that philosophy was employed in inventing the wheel. I meant to say that a mind with the capacity for philosophy was able to do so. Philosophy is a broad term. In this respect, I mean to say that the human mind is capable of logic, reasoning, and understanding cause and effect in the universe as it sees it. It is this power of mind that allows humans to do such things as invent wheels. The closest we can get to a direct relation here is by calling philosophy the pursuit of knowledge. Without such a pursuit, would the wheel have ever come about?

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"The great enemy of clear language is insincerity. [...] In our age there is no such thing as 'keeping out of politics.' All issues are political issues, and politics itself is a mass of lies, evasions, folly, hatred, and schizophrenia. When the general atmosphere is bad, language must suffer."

—"Politics and the English Language," George Orwell

"Humankind cannot bear very much reality."

—"Burnt Norton," Four Quartets, T. S. Eliot

Willravel

BG, I see what you mean now. Thank you for clarifying.

Honestly? I consider philosophy to be a form of entertainment. There's no such thing as inherent meaning. It's all subjective.

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Baraka_Guru

Postmodernism is dead. Prepare for the next shift in philosophy and cultural theory. Our French friends had their run, and now it's time to start making some sense of things.

If anything, you're going to have to extend the phrase "it's all subjective." It's not all subjective, actually. This is an illusion. It's only mostly subjective.

If it were all subjective, 9/11 has little meaning. Does 9/11 have significant meaning?

__________________
"The great enemy of clear language is insincerity. [...] In our age there is no such thing as 'keeping out of politics.' All issues are political issues, and politics itself is a mass of lies, evasions, folly, hatred, and schizophrenia. When the general atmosphere is bad, language must suffer."

—"Politics and the English Language," George Orwell

"Humankind cannot bear very much reality."

—"Burnt Norton," Four Quartets, T. S. Eliot

Willravel

Meaning? Not even a little. Consequences? Of course.

One of the nice things about becoming atheist is that I was able to, as an adult, be totally honest in my reconstruction of my understanding of the universe. Things are or aren't. The only way something can have meaning is if it's assigned meaning by the person or entity that's examining it.

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Hain

I will read this whole thread when I have time, but I feel philosophy is the logical conclusion of understanding the nature of the universe.

1. The universe was made of inanimate matter that reacted and became the galaxies, suns, planets, and eventually us - Physics
2. We became curious as to our role with each other, and had to understand - Psychology
3. We wanted to find what was the real intention of our being with the rest of the universe - Philosophy

Or put otherwise:

• This one tell you where you're going [Philosophy]
• This one tells you where you are [psychology]
• This one tells you where you were [Physics]

Baraka_Guru

There are many entities who have "examined" or are "examining" 9/11 and its consequences.

Only a postmodernist could argue that it was meaningless--that since it was observed through a proxy of the media, 9/11 is merely yet another tidbit of simulacra.

Baudrillard is dead too. Literally.

The question of this thread, "What is philosophy?" is an important one today. Our mode of thinking coming out of the 20th century is necessarily going through a shift. As an atheist, you likely know that the one aspect of this shift includes a rise of a global secular society (while simultaneously maintaining spiritual counterparts). But this shift as a whole is far more complex than any one of us can imagine. With the advent of communication technology (and virtually every other form of new technology today), the degrees of abstraction that surround us simply boggle our minds.

Philosophy is just as important today as it ever was.

__________________
"The great enemy of clear language is insincerity. [...] In our age there is no such thing as 'keeping out of politics.' All issues are political issues, and politics itself is a mass of lies, evasions, folly, hatred, and schizophrenia. When the general atmosphere is bad, language must suffer."

—"Politics and the English Language," George Orwell

"Humankind cannot bear very much reality."

—"Burnt Norton," Four Quartets, T. S. Eliot

Ustwo

Philosophy is where your personal intelligence, logic, and education break down and you have to start bullshiting with what sounds good and makes sense to you despite not having all the variables you need to make a valid judgment.

Discussing philosophy is therefore when two unprovable opinions collide and becomes an exercise in mental masturbation as no one can really prevail no matter how absurd the others position. It can be amusing though when one can at least, from a argumentative position, show how ridiculous another's philosophy seems, but they will still believe in the cosmic zombie when its over.

Its even more fun when one persons limitations in knowledge and intelligence create a philosophy that is directly disprovable by someone with superior education and intelligence. In these cases, the 'loser' will normally take their ball and go home. At times though, you will get someone who thinks they are in the superior position, when in fact they are just not worth talking to and those people will therefore think they won the argument, when in fact you just stopped wasting time.

As you can see philosophy is more fun than a barrel of space monkeys.

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MirrorsrorriM

Philo=love of
sophy=thinking

Philosophy means, literally, "the love of thinking"

why do we love thinking? Lao Tzu, the founder of Taoism, (and that '69' symbol thingy) the great chinese philosopher says it is because we are too lazy and stupid to actually do anything. we generalize our reality because we are too stupid to concieve of things in their true,, particulate form. In other words, reality is too complex for us, so we try and simplify it, with laws, axioms, proverbs, etc, etc. (even the 'etc, etc' part was laziness of thought.)

Our animal nature, however, is what makes us dogmatic in our thinking and philosophy. We want to impose our thinking, impose our will on others by making them, or tricking them into thinking what we want them to think. People, either consciously or perhaps, to the extent our own animal nature is subconscious, subconsciously preach what we want OTHER people to believe, in other words, we lie to them, in order to domesticate, pacify, or confuse them with words and render them either neutral, or we are communicating in order to achieve a common goal based on mutual surivival, propogation.

Christianity is a good example of our subconcious animal nature, Televangelists preach a doctrine that tells you to give all your money away, to achieve oneness with God, but they aren't giving YOU money, they want YOU to give them YOUR money. It's like saying, 'here, drink this poison and it will make you stronger' only you fake like you're gonna drink it then don't drink it at the last second, hoping the other person gulps his cool-aid down.

filtherton

Philosophy also provides a great opportunity for intellectual elitism, like when someone assumes that superior education has anything to do with the ability to reason effectively from a philosophical standpoint, as if credentials matter in a discussions about things unknowable. Usually, these folk make pretty blatant mistakes in characterizing their positions, like making bold statements about reason and logic and in doing so unwittingly giving away the fact that they don't really know much about what reason and logic actually are.

MirrorsrorriM

Exactly. It's mostly just feeling up eachother, probing eachother for weakness or strength. I didn't mean to imply Christianity is inferior to any of the other traditional poisonous religions, for example, Taoism teaches the same thing, essentially as Christianity, it teaches you to just be still, do nothing, lay there, let other people fuck you. the passive principle, to be the nail, the thing acted upon. to be the slave to the stronger will, to be animated by the forces that surround you, rather to attempt to be the animator, because there is nothing you can really do about it, anyways.

But you are right, we are what we are, we are animals with a mind that allows us to concieve of our animal nature, but it does not change it. We can pretend to be superior by shaping our personality in the image of the anti-Beast, but even then, we are really expressing our beastiality, by pretending to be anti-Beast, and thus superior.

Only when we can agree with another person, that you and me are superior, to those other people, can we really have a sense of true equality and comraderie.

Willravel

And to those individual minds it has subjective meaning, but outside of people unwilling to simply take it as it was it's meaningless. There's no meaning behind that.

Ustwo - well said.

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roachboy